A I S E H M A N . O R G

Research by Linda KF, PhD. Worcester St. College,
THE EDGE

……Probably nowhere is the effect of the PAP government's success more noticeable, or more likely to help gain loyalty, than in its public housing policies. In an effort to mix various ethnic and religious groups together, as a means of preventing antagonisms among groups, it established a quota system of sorts that has become a model for other societies. The maintenance of racial harmony in Singapore can best be explained by shifting the emphasis from ethnic to national identity. W.E. Willmott (1989, p.589) cites how, while the purpose of integrating different ethnic groups in the high-rises may have been for integration, a more important result of the national housing policy has been the provision "for citizens of all income levels the opportunity of owning a flat and therefore of 'having a stake in the country.'"

…..While Singapore-born citizens may now be the norm, it is important to recall that when the Republic was first developed in 1965 that most residents had immigrated from other homelands, and had other allegiances; hence, conceptions of nation-building and national identity had to be built from scratch. While ethnic residential concentration marked the island's initial statehood, later, as Chew Sock Foon (1989, p.30) has pointed out, "Ethnic enclavement had been made somewhat less obtrusive through the Singapore Housing Development Board (HDB)-implemented public housing program which allocated low cost government-built flats to economically eligible Singapore citizens on a 'first come, first served' basis without regard to ethnic group membership."

….These are the country's stated "core values": 1.Nation before community and society before self; 2. Family as the basic unit of society; 3.Community support and respect for the individual; 4.Consensus, not conflict; and 5.Racial and religious harmony. This is its National Pledge:

We, the citizens of Singapore
Pledge ourselves, as one united people
Regardless of race, language, or religion
To build a democratic society
Based on justice and equality
So as to achieve happiness
Prosperity and progress for our nation.

….To date, Singapore has spent a fair amount of time self-diagnosing its attitudes and actions regarding ethnic relations (e.g., Fung, 1996). While only a fraction of the population can recall its race riots in the early 1960s, the various Singaporean cultures witness daily instances of misunderstandings, both rhetorically and according to varying customs ….

…It is in education where the widest Singaporean racial rift is visible. While Chinese parents choose schools that teach in English, with Mandarin as a second language, Malay parents prefer ones that offer Malay. Yan and Thomas (1995) have studied Chinese and American parents in terms of interactions with their children's physical activities, ........

Aisehman:

You are right. Two wrongs do not make a right. LKY is saying that "Singapore understands the reality of Malaysian politics. We have NEVER PROTESTED at these attacks on our multi-racial system or our policies, except to clarify our own position when necessary".

What LKY seems to be saying is that by protesting against his remarks, Malaysian politicians are hypocrites. Why? Because he has not said anything more than what he has said many times before and in fact said less than what he had written in his memoirs published in 1998.

AAB felt that LKY's statement could have incited the feelings of Malaysians. I dont think so because LKY's has said that many times before and most Malaysians already know about the character of LKY.

I believe the analysis is biased towards certain aspects, since it touches lightly on Chinese education. Since the ancient days, education has been the first priority for Chinese and the students strived hard to excel in their examination. This is evident nowdays in the public examinations where the ratio of Chinese student that did well, outbeats other ethnic group. We shall not accept any act that will deprive Chinese an education opportunity, either by the ineffective quota system or reducing the Chinese primary schools. If Chinese education has been proven effective, instead of integrating Chinese/Tamil school with the national school, why not we do it the other way round? For us, this is a unacceptable and severe marginalisation when an effective system has been abolished "for the sake of particular race".

I worked in Singapore for years and have socialised well with a group of Malay friends. They have never being deny a education opportunity since it is the individual performance that judges whether one will make it to the top or not. There have been drug abuse problem in the community, but what is the factor that causes it? Is it the government that causes one to fail in their examination and others to be on drug abuse? Think twice. I have seen successful Malay, who has distinct character then the rest of the community and I believe it is the individual effort that determines who you are going to be.

i'm no fan of the cocky, nosy kiasu lee. he might have worked near-miracle for singapore, n singapore owes a lot to him, he's undoubtedly smart; but i'm no singaporean, so he means nothing to me.

n i don't disagree with u either, aisehman. your comments have been fair, except the following.

the situation here is tricky - we attacked lee for ignoring the plight of his own malays, but that criticism applies to us ALSO.

AD HOMINEM is the word - applicable to BOTH lee n us: when lee started his tirade, that's what we did to him. now, when he wrote his letter, he did the same to us. it's NEVER-ENDING, and it's also WIN-WIN for both sides, because BOTH can portray himself as the hero of his own race.

that's the usual 'hero tactic' trick to DIVERT ATTENTION from INTERNAL problems. if u have lived long enough in malaysia, u should have gotten bored of it by now...

for those of us who managed not to fall for it, let's regain our FOCUS.

"Two wrongs do not make a right."
i absolutely agree.

so, REGARDLESS of whether races in singapore, japan, usa, congo, fiji, uk, turkey, israel, australia, nepal, timbuktu n sankara... have been marginalised, WHAT'S THE SITUATION IN MALAYSIA, OUR HOME??

God WILL condemn THEM for THEIR sins, so we don't have to campur tangan. let's talk about OURS.

i don't f**king care if racial genocides n exterminations r going on in the rest of the world, all i want to know is have we tried to make OUR HOMELAND a paradise for EVERY citizen, as every country should be??

comparing us to those who r WORSE than us, but not to those who r BETTER than us, is a lousier trick than the politician's 'hero tactic'.

it's a SCHOOLBOY's trick - those who score C- excusing themselves by pointing to those scoring D+ n below, the second last in the class comparing himself to the last.

on the other hand, so long as we have tried OUR BEST, then even if all we get is D-, at least our conscience is clear, n God - i'm quite confident - would give us a gentle pat on our backs.

have WE tried OUR BEST? that IS the question.

Comparing the 2 countries' policies on racial : One benefits the minority and the other benefits the majority! Think about it!

I also thought it was a "papal" apology - "I'm not sorry for what I said, I'm just sorry about how you reacted to what I said. Poor you."

And he probably confirmed his own views by now that this Malaysian Government under this PM is chopped liver. Lest we forget the old man has a penchant of stress-testing the mettle of others, even on a high-stakes plane. Other than swimming, his other sport is that he likes to confirm to himself that he's right about people's characters.

An ambiguous, almost dithering response given by the PM yesterday is an invitation for a second "incident". Perhaps a bigger manoeuvre is on the cards.

I think you have not read LKW's letter, he did not appologised, he said he is "sorry", just like for example when yr family memeber died, I said "I am so sorry that you feel so sad." That's all.

I don't really care if the blacks are marginalised in America or the UK. I don't care if the Chinese are marginalised in Indonesia or in Singapore. I care when the Chinese are marginalised in Malaysia because this is where I live, and this is where I will be buried. I agree that we should be looking at our own faults before bothering to point out the faults of our neighbours. It starts with an open acknowledgement that the Chinese, amongst others, are marginalised in Malaysia. Of course the orang asli are also marginalised, just like the poor Malays, the Indians. Now who in government has the balls to acknowledge this ?

You are all right in one way or another.

My point is this: We have problems, other people have problems. No one is blameless.

We fix our house, other people fix theirs. We each mind our own business.

Good post, Aisehman. When it comes to marginalization, IMHO, there will always be a certain amount of it anywhere.

What's important is to not get sidetracked by the nitty-gritty, but to look at this problem from a more holistic view - did a post on this, inspired by yours (since your comments don't support linking, its at http://asylum60.blogspot.com/2006/10/living-in-margins.html).

Some might find it pie-in-the-sky idealistic, but it's something I stand by...

Why the big fuss about what LKY said when we have left KJ alone with his racist remarks?

There is a saying that goes something like this:

kerbau di depan mata tak nampak tapi kuman sebarang laut nampak!

Yes, LKY should apologize....same way....the keris weilding dude also needs to apologize....also the people who used the work keling in parliament...also the guys who asked non malays to keluar dari malaysia....why these fuckers can get away with statements like this?

Aisehman,

i 100% agree with what u said at October 4, 2006 02:31 PM.

If all we did was to mind our own business, it would be very hard to progress. Sometimes you need an outsider to point out what is wrong to help you realise it.

Instead of denying LKY's statement, we should take it to heart and see whether it's or not. And if it is, we should then change it.

Btw, I think they say that the chinese are positively discriminated not marginalised. Hahah. So sad :(

A Malaysia run by S'pore must be the hidden agenda of LKY. He must be feeling frustrated engulfed in his 'concrete jungle' & planning to get even for having being literally 'kicked out' of the Malaysian configuration.
It is a fact that if UMNO loses power in Malaysia, the Malays along with the Indians will be in deep shit. Hence LKY must be seeking support of the empty vessels DAP & Keadilan - two organisations who have no moral political principles. LKY would surely be wanting to use the current unsettled political atmosphere in Malaysia to make his presence felt.

Dear Aisehman,

I think your point about "Two wrongs doesn't make a right" is misleading. What two wrongs are you talking about? The marginalisation of certain races in both Spore and Malaysia ? If that's the case, LKY didn't commit two wrongs - if anything, he can only be said to be "wrong" as his country also practices marginalisation. Unless you are advocating self censorship or diplomatic restraint, where's the "wrongness" in LKY voicing his opinion to his audience?

In fact, Aisehman, your point about "Two wrongs don't make a right" can only make sense when applied to the Malaysian politicians who counters by saying that Singapore is just as bad to the Malays. If it is true that Singapore also practices "marginalisation" of some races, I'll say to our politicians : "what's the relevance of that to LKY's point?" "Two wrongs don't make a right!"

Anyway, I have difficulties with your point about minding our own business. LKY has no political influence here. Whatever he says shouldn't hurt us if it's nonsense. We're 49 years old as a nation and it's kinda sad don't you think that we get all excited within the nation about a statement made by a political nobody in Malaysia. Why all the hoohah, unless it really is a problem? If so, why don't our politicians just accept it and explain to the non-bumis nicely why we still need the NEP. Stop brandishing the keris to show that the Malays are the boss. This only increases non-bumis' animosity towards the Malays. It'll be interesting to know Singapore's collective / ethnic response when we make similar statements to the same effect on Singapore's practices. Then we can draw our own conclusions as to the extent of the marginalisation in both countries.

P/S: When you say the Malays in Singapore are marginalised and that this is wrong, are you implying that Singapore should therefore practice positive discrimination (or affirmative action) for the Malays? For Malaysia, when the non-bumis claim to be marginalised, I don't think they're looking for a lift - they're asking for equality.

KISS:

What I meant by "two wrongs don't make a right" is that both the remarks that our politicians have made in the past and which LKY referred to, and LKY's recent remarks, are wrong.

It's like I throw a stone at you, now you throw a stone back at me. When will it end?

I have problems with the statement, "LKY has no political influence here. Whatever he says shouldn't hurt us if it's nonsense."

See it this way: Malay leaders here have no political influence in Thailand.

But if out of nowhere, Pak Lah or Najib or Hishammudin publicly start making a lot of noise about Thai Muslims, how do you think the Thai government would feel?

"Nonsense" is subjective. Played up the right way, nonsense can start to make a lot of sense to the audience that it is targeted at.

That's politics for you.

Should Singapore have affirmative action for the Malays?

To be marginalised is to be denied equal access to a level playing field.

I would hardly equate the removal of barriers with so-called affirmative action.

I would call it justice, the same justice that the Chinese in this country demand.

"For Malaysia, when the non-bumis claim to be marginalised, I don't think they're looking for a lift - they're asking for equality."

how true. that is my definition of marginalised. non bumis does not have equal rights/priveleges as bumis, thus non bumis are marginalised. period.

"It is a fact that if UMNO loses power in Malaysia, the Malays along with the Indians will be in deep shit" by bnaipal

For god sake, pls compare the state of economy of indian decendant, if they r still being called that, in both country, singapore and malaysia, before you shoot.

Let me rephrase the sentense:
"It is a fact that if UMNO hold on to power in Malaysia, the Malays along with the Indians and chinese will be in deep shit, sooner or later"

Results speaks louder than mere word my fren. The indian are already at its rock bottom now even if you compared with pre-merdeka days. umnoputra's economy jumped by leaps and bound, but not the malays. chinese's been stagnant ever since. I dont think i have to mention the "yang lain-lain" category.

Look at the pace of development of other ASEAN countries my fren. go look at vietnam(lower cost)/singapore(higher tech) my fren. If these policies continues, who would choose Malaysia?

If we still dont wake up to the harsh reality that nobody owes anyone any living, we will wake up one fine day to see malaysia turning into philipine/argentina (bankrupt country). I think the countdown to vision 2020 already begins. Just look at cyberjaya/proton/our E&E industry...dan lain lain

We will all sink as one.

Well, AAB got his clarification from LKY and much, much more.

LKY, by going public with his reply, has pre-empted AAB's next move (if there was one in the first place).

It also shows LKY has no gumption in showing up AAB for what he is truly is - an incompetent PM.

What can AAB do now to save his 'face'? Play more golf?

There is another option. AAB can start addressing the problems at home rather than trying to 'impress' us with his foreign relation
manuevers for which he is ill equiped to handle.

Dear Aisehman

You started this blog with definition of marginalisation and went on to say that "If the Chinese are marginalised in Malaysia, then so are the Malays in Singapore.

If it is wrong to marginalise the Chinese in Malaysia, then it is equally wrong to marginalise the Malays in Singapore."

I would like you to explain the first part - how the Malays are marginalised in S'pore? I am a M'sian working in S'pore and have Malay friends here. There are all given equal opportunity to study and apply for housing, jobs, etc. There is no discrimination such as quota to limit a certain race from progressing in his/her education. There are no rules to compel any individual or company to set aside a certain number of shares for a certain race, there are also no restrictions for joining any armed forces or police, in fact, all male S'poreans (including 2nd generation male permanent residents) must perform national service - be it in the armed forces (Army, Navy, Airforce) or other uniformed agencies (such as Police or Civil Defence).

In fact the S'pore Govt. has gone on to give out goodies to all S'poreans (regardless of race) and tried to provide it in an equitable manner - i.e. those on low income getting more than those on higher income.

The same cannot be said about what the M'sian Govt. has done under UMNO with its NEP and positive discrimination to the elite UMNO putras... There are quotas on education places in universities and colleges and rather than practice meritocracy where the student with the best results get in, you have many (too numerous) situations where a Chinese student with excellent results not getting into U or college or not given the course that he/she would like to pursue and yet, Malay students with much poorer results getting in! No wonder the level of intellect in the Us and colleges getting worse as this is a vicious cycle....

And then you have the rules such as companies must set aside 30% shares for bumiputras, or that Govt. tenders are only given to bumiputras, or bumiputras must be given 5 - 10% when buying their home whereas non-bumis do not get such benefits, etc., etc.

Where is the 'marginalisation' of Malays in S'pore that you are referring to? When you compare the 2 countries, S'pore seem to be at least fair in treating its citizens, regardless of race or religion.... Is that happening in M'sia?

....and the only way we are going to clean our own house will be to attempt to change the government through the ballot box. Aisehman: in a previous thread, you asked if we, the right-thinking Malaysians, have the balls to vote for change. Those who follow your blog will have the balls to vote for change, and the task before us is to help educate the marginalised - whether they are Chinese, Malays, Indians or orang asli - to vote for change.

Technocrati

To be fair to Aisehman
Being realistic, there is unofficially, such random marginalisation in the private sector . Eg mandarin speaking.

Hi,

Random marginalisation because of language proficiency? stop repeating the same excuse over and over again. its not funny anymore.

Not all malaysian/singaporean indian, chinese, malays can speak english, chinese, malays or indian! If You have an extra knowledge of a language good! if not go learn some languages. Its to your avantage. Its not marginalisation or discrimination.

I have a japanese engineer in my company who only speak japanese, nothing else. and i have to work 5 years to match his annual salary. Btw, i speak chinese, malay, english. so my company discriminate against me? or why not they employ a malay in his position? Look at your skill level fren, before you shoot.

institutionalised marginalisation/ discrimination? thats totally different story. you dont like to be born where u have no choice and be discriminated becoz of the color of your skin.

38% of Singaporean Malay families made more than $3000 (US$) monthly. What's the percentage of Malays in Malaysia making more than US$ 3000 monthly?

ajohore,

i don't know whether what Technocrati said is true, n i don't want to take any position on whether singaporean non-chinese r in fact marginalised or not. neither do i agree or disagree with ur allegation about 'mandarin-discrimination'.

but there is a huge difference between official n ur so-called 'unofficial' discrimination.

when it's unofficial, there's NO moral legitimacy, n people only do it discreetly n not blatantly (ie. there is a LIMIT to how far they would go), n when found out, they would try to deny. that way, it's under control to a huge extent. they would feel ASHAMED.

but when it's OFFICIAL, people would feel that there's a MORAL LEGITIMACY to it. it's RIGHT, FAIR + JUST to do it!! they discriminate WITH SELF-RIGHTEOUSNESS + PRIDE - ARROGANCE even. n if u dare to disagree with them, they'll feel it's their god given right to silence u, to accuse u of provocation or stirring up hatred, or 'playing with fire'.

http://www.malaysiakini.com/news/57710
Umno warns Chinese group not to play with fire
Soon Li Tsin
Oct 4, 06 6:10pm

The Penang Chinese Chamber of Commerce (PCCC) call for abolition of the 30 percent bumiputera quota in housing and commercial projects has been labelled a racial statement and Umno has warned the chamber not to “play with fire”.

- Rationale behind proposal
- ‘Our land, our rights’

when it's official, to suppress dissent n to bully dissenters is NOT SHAMEFUL at all. even violence is justified.

so stop accusing people of 'unofficial' this n that. just look at all the SHAMELESS things the UMNOPUTRAS have done to others (including the MOST original bumis of all bumis - orang asli n non-muslim natives of east malaysia) in the name of protecting interests of the 'bumis'.

tell me, if u r a bumi or a muslim, that u r NOT ONE BIT ASHAMED about it.

I find it very funny when Malays use the 'if your'e not happy, leave!" reason the chinese get all worked up.

Suddenly, they become all patriotic. Come on laa....those who whinge and complain end up still doing the same routine day in, day out. Those who are smart, and know that there is a better place out there - leave. This does not only apply to chinese but to the malay professionals as well. And you dont here them griping about how pathetic their lives are because they have taken their destiny in their own hands.

If you want to fight for equal rights then start ACTING like it.

Learn to assimilate see how the Kelantan Chinese are. They are taken as brothers by their malay counterparts who look at race, religion last. So what would be the common denominator?- language and assimilation.

But, nooooo.....The chinese folks have been here for 2 generations and YET they cannot even speak the national language? I believe it is not because they can't but they REFUSE to. So how do you expect to even talk about equality when you yourselves are happy to live within your race, can't and wont even speak malay to save yourselves, refuse and do not turn up for national service, send your kids to chinese schools, indoctrinate them from small that the other races are lazy, refuse to join the army/police (as it doesnt make you rich)?
The list is not exhaustive..

Just look at KL now and tell me....

Don't be stupid laa... strategize laa sikit..learn to assimilate and master the language first then only can you have more leverage to ask for equality.....bitching in blogs while you have happy living in SS2 with minimal contact with other races aint gonna cut it.

'Marginalisation because of language proficiency' is a policy followed by many companies. And it does not make sense to bring in the 'Orang Asli' to act as a buffer in declaring that UMNOputra is playing a dirty game.

"Learn to assimilate see how the Kelantan Chinese are. They are taken as brothers by their malay counterparts who look at race, religion last. So what would be the common denominator?- language and assimilation."

Dont be stupid la brader. You think after they become like malay/orang asli, boleh cakap melayu, hidup sebiji macam melayu, they become accepted? So Did the kelate chinese has equal right now? Their sons and daughter have been discriminated not 2 but more than 5 generation. Even the Melaka sultanate treat them better. So dont be stupid la.

One fine example- tengok la seberang. they cakap indon, makan indon, tidur indon, hisap indon, are they taken in as their lot? something happen, who r the 1st sheep to be blamed? the chinese! the minority, becoz they r weak in number. easy prey.

Then there is umnoputra's decendant that studied in international's school. They speak english and hardly speak proper malays. Do they get the privilege? u bet. Language my foot, its your skin color.

The list is definately not exhausive.

so dont bull here, tron.

If it was not initiated from the highest level, its only "pi mai pi mai tang tu".

brader bnaipal dont even know what hes trying to say. he just say that u no good. your argument no good. I m impressed :P

Ya, allah. asking to be treated equally as fellow human being is so difficult.

bnaipal,

u have not been able to respond to my argument (that official discrimination is in a very different category from 'unofficial' ones), but u did answer my question of whether u would feel ASHAMED about it or NOT.

it only "makes sense to bring in the 'Orang Asli' to act as a buffer" if it's true. orang asli n the borneo natives are only useful as the chinamen's most useful 'buffer' if their marginalisation is true.

so, tell us it's NOT. please, DISPROVE - by pointing out that the prime minister of malaysia (or his deputy... how about one of the cabinet ministers? deputy minister...? state menteri besar...?) is an orang asli; that the chief minister of sarawak is a dayak, the majority race; that the poorest race in sabah r not kadazandusuns.

tron,

assimilation is a form of political SUBJUGATION. it not only asserts that one language/culture is more superior/inferior than the other, it also aims to deny the existence and continuity of the language/culture of the subjugated race.

most chinese believe that "u should not do to others what u don't want to be done to u." for them, just like they don't intend on 'reverse-assimilating' all malays/muslims, they think it's only fair that malays/muslims don't do it either.

they actually feel unfair n sad that the malays/muslims ruling class doesn't respect their culture as equal. but then if they understand that the malays/muslims ruling class do not intend to treat anybody other than their own race/religion as EQUAL - hence EVERYBODY ELSE is pendatang or infidel - they'll know why no other culture/language can exist in Tanah MELAYU (n it's BORNEO COLONY).

fyi, china has been a world power and ancient civilization many thousand years before other living civilizations today came into existence, including islam. chinese culture also has a lot of sophisticated ideas which still benefits the world tremendously (SAME FOR ISLAM) such as medicine and ethics.

so, just as it is NORMAL for muslims to be proud of their heritage, it's also normal for chinese to feel the same.

no race would willingly accept assimilation, it's human nature. just ask the millions of muslims who have migrated to europe and usa today - why didn't they 'assimilate' into the christian culture and lifestyle, but still hold on to their muslim heritage? the chinese are not doing anything different.

but of course, just bcos others also refuse to assimilate doesn't mean that it's right for chinese to do it here. so, the debate should be on how has non-assimilation REALLY impeded national unity and integration, and how is it UNPATRIOTIC.

AND, also whether the existence of chinese culture has NOT contributed to enriching the lives of malaysians n MALAYS themselves.

- ask those MALAYS who send their kids to chinese schools bcos they r given better quality education n discipline despite financial starvation, n those MALAYS who prefer to visit a chinese tabib n take chinese medicine than to trust western medicine or MALAY doctors who r trained in our local medical schools.

just bcos the chinese, by non-assimilation, has not agreed that the malay/islamic culture is superior IS NOT RELEVANT - u can't ask people to assimilate just bcos your RACIAL/RELIGIOUS PRIDE is hurt. maybe for UMNOPUTRAS, that's different, bcos it's THEIR lands.

n just bcos they refuse to think that malay/islamic culture is more superior than their own does NOT MEAN that they think that malay/islamic culture is therefore INFERIOR.

- what if they don't have any opinion one way or the other? or what if they regard others as equal, or that comparison is meaningless or insulting or necessarily contentious?

chinese r pretty 'agnostic' people, seldom spend time evaluating other religions/cultures n to demonise them, unlike some who like to accuse chinese of being a 'pagan culture', 'idol worshippere' n hell-bent on 'civilizing the infidels'.

n please don't accuse other races of having a stereotype about malays/muslims. what matters is whether u really are like that in real life, which will confirm or debunk the 'lazy native' myth.

one interesting comparison is THAILAND. today, chinese have fully assimilated n united with the natives without as much blood shed as places like indonesia. why?

i truly believe that we can truly SAVE SO MUCH OF OUR ENERGIES AND TIME (like now... my assignment is due next monday!!) n spend them on meeting the challenges of globalisation, ESPECIALLY CHINA; STAY FOCUSED AND NOT DISTRACTED by the UMNOPUTRAS, MCAPUTRAS, MICPUTRAS, etc -- if the malays/muslims:

a) accept diversity as a strength.

"049.013: O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things)."

b) give the chinese a SENSE OF SECURITY, that if they love u, u'll "love them back."

(ala Gubra, filem yang:
1, Menghina Melayu Dan Islam
http://tehranifaisal.blogspot.com/2006/09/filem-gubra-menghina-melayu-dan-islam.html

2, Menyesatkan
http://wmzuls.blogspot.com/2006/04/gubra-yang-menyesatkan.html

3, Sesat Lagi Menyesatkan
http://www.harakahdaily.net/v06/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2063&Itemid=1

- my point on Gubra: don't demonise any malay/muslim whenever they try to reach out to others. don't marginalise them. don't turn them into an outcast.

c) treat everybody fairly n as equal, n don't SUSPEND your sense of fairness/equalty just bcos u r dealing with infidels.

d) see things from the OTHER SIDE's point of view, don't be selfish or self-centered.

e) n generally, look FORWARD. don't always go back to the Pangkor Treaty of 1874 etc (when Tanah Melayu begins to b OFFICIALLY polluted by the pendatangs n the putras lost control over their own soils...), bcos everybody else's starting point is 1957/1963.

- this story of malaysia is so complicated, i don't even know how to end it tidily... thanks for reading.

LKY is a racist with long malice intentions on the Malays and Malaysia.

Download this Waspada Malaysia article series by a former PAP activist that was published on MalaysiaKini from the following web addrress:

http://www.savefile.com/projects/1018550

Sigh....see what did I tell you guys?

Cepat melatah....

Suddenly people become patriotic and start spewing verses and using God's name in vain (nice try but pathetic nonetheless) ... to justify themselves..

Talk to the chinese in Kepong, SS2 etc and ask them if they gift a rat's arse about assimilation with other races or perpaduan for that matter?

And you expect the malays to give in more? At the current state, like hell they will, umnoputra or no umnputra.

Still aint gonna cut it, mate...be prepared to bitch in blogs until the cows come home as that is just the way its gonna be.

China is gonna be powerhouse real soon. So what's keeping you?

tron,

i'm so disappointed at myself to know that i "Still aint gonna cut it" with u. how i would die to obtain your approval n agreement.

for a sore loser (who lost the debate by bitching meaninglessly "in blogs until the cows come home" n yet accuse others for doing that as if that qualifies as an ARGUMENT/REBUTTAL), u r pretty funny.

since u insist on having the last word even if it means u r only capable of keep repeating yourself, i won't reply to any of your post after this. keep ranting.

p.s. when u visit "Kepong, SS2 etc", let's go for a drink. if u r interested, give me your number, i'll call u... ;P

Eh hello Tron

What the hell are you bitching about in the blogs? With regards to assimilation, what is your definition? Are you going to ask all non-Malays and non-muslims to change their names to arabic sounding names, convert to islam, then that is called assimilation?

Already the govt. has imposed on the studying of Malay and had imposed the use of Malay as a medium of instruction and many of the younger M'sians are now speaking Malay, in fact to the detriment of themselves and their future. I recall that there was a news article where the foreign ministry lamented that their officer could not speak English for nuts as they do not have a good command of English and they not only let themselves down but embarrass the country!!

Look at where Malay as a language will take us. Be truthful, tron, other than Malaysia and perhaps Indonesia, where in the world would Malay be used for business or other purposes? Tell me....

The issue here is the marginalisation of non-Malays in Malaysia and you know that this is true and you cannot accept it for this will expose how bankrupt the Umnoputras are in running the country. They cannot run the place properly in a clean and transparent manner, using their integrity. Instead resort to using 'EXCUSES' that the Malays need a leg up to be 'equal' to the other races... Well, what do you know... after 30 plus years since the NEP, the Malays still HAVE NOT reached the share holding of 30% - this despite the fact that ALL companies going for listing in Bursa Saham KL need to allocate 30% to the bumis... Can you explain if 30% was first issued to the bumis, how come 30 plus years later, the bumis' share holding is still 18.9%?? These are excuses.... perpetrated by the ruling elite to con the majority of the Malays in M'sia, you think the Umnoputras would give you a rat's arse how you are faring in life?

Not true that all marginalization is the same. There is a natural order called Darwinianism that we are far from capable of overcoming. Its the unrealistic liberal left that thinks that all negative natural order can be fixed somehow.

Yes, does Malay in Singapore feel marginalization pressure? All minority groups feel some natural order of marginalization, gays, handicapped, geeks, ugly girls, etc. Winners takes the prize and losers well, lose.

Natural marginalization is no excuse for not trying to fix it definitely and Singapore has never denied that it should try. Otherwise they would not be free education and at one time free medical care. Could it do more? Sure.

However Malaysia deny what it actually do - a unnatural marginalization driven by man-made policy of inequlity under the law. NEP is no longer just about affirmative action, its actually about marginalization - it seeks to deny and limit the natural potential of its own citizen. Its quite another to just say leave them alone and make the rules clear.

No, the two wrong is not equal. Some wrongs are just more wrong, much more wrong.

Hi tron,

I think its a waste of my time to further comment. Whatever i wanna comment technocrati already done a good job.

You know why you lose? You just cant defend nonsense. But you sure can be a sore loser. Stating things like "cepat melatah" or "China is gonna be powerhouse real soon. So what's keeping you?" which is tantamount to "KELUAR DARI MALAYSIA"

If you have nothing intelligent to add, you can always opt to keep quiet. This way at least your buddies wont feel embarassed or shameful.

Oh sorry,

I mentioned technocrati instead of Juslo. Its Juslo that I refer to. My bad.

tron, bnaipal et al,

sorry to b pathetic n to bitch again, but i'm not quoting the Quran this time.

in case u r having a hard time trying to give an answer to my question of whether u r one bit ASHAMED or not, here's a suggestion.

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/nst/Wednesday/Frontpage/20061011080426/index.pda
'Sins' of the son
11 Oct 2006
Farrah Naz Karim

PUTRAJAYA: There was an air of disbelief at the Customs Department yesterday when Datuk Muhammad Abdul Ghani shovelled all the blame for the AP-clone scandal on his son.

Disbelief then turned to the bizarre when the senator ticked off his son Mohd Zulaimi for being a novice at cheating.

"He (his son) is not clever at doing it ... to be a fraudster you need skills. Fraudsters should always be a notch above their victims. If one were smart, one wouldn’t clone all the APs in a week. There should at least be a three-month interval.

"HE DIDN'T LEARN FROM ME OR I COULD HAVE GIVEN HIM SOME TIPS," he said, in the presence of the Customs director of prevention Mohamed Adnan Ariffin.

- what do ya think?! man, if i were an UMNOPUTRA or 1 of their associates, i would b so damn proud of the senator...

UMNO boleh!!!! Long Live Never-Ending Policy!!!